Suggestions from Jakub

Stuff you would like to see in the world of Eliatopia.
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masnam
Posts: 538
Joined: Mon Jan 06, 2020 8:52 pm

Suggestions from Jakub

Post by masnam » Sun Mar 21, 2021 1:42 am

Jakub gave me some balance suggestions that I wrote down to make a post on, so if something doesn't make sense or you disagree, go spam Jakub.

1. Remove the defense stat

Most RPG's don't have a defense stat and the defense stat can let any class become tanky which = bad.

2. Multiple/more classes

Warrior, knight, paladin, wizard, battle mage, huntress, archer, etc. or have the generic melee ranged and magic and have subsets of different playstyles. No main reason given here.

3. Runes and stones need a rework and they shouldn't be immediately thrown in your face

Runes shouldn’t be introduced until alion. Jakub said he doesn’t really like runes in general and they should be removed but that obviously isn’t happening so he didn’t give examples of reworks. As he would say, cope.

4. Remove stores closing

He didn't give any reasons other than no good reason for them to close. And if your reason is that it's realistic, don’t even bother responding.

5. Damage formula fix

"Makes no sense that the stats from armor and the stats from themselves are weighted the same" is exactly what he said.

6. Mail system

Items that don’t sell could get mailed back to you and patch notes could be sent in the mail

7. Remove kb from monsters when taking low damage

"that shouldn't be happening when you take 1 damage".



Jakub didn't say "And if your reason is that it's realistic, don't even bother responding." That was from me.
Last edited by masnam on Sun Mar 21, 2021 7:29 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Jakub34
Posts: 477
Joined: Wed Jul 17, 2019 11:03 pm

Re: Suggestions from Jakub

Post by Jakub34 » Sun Mar 21, 2021 1:46 am

My big response coming to this, soon™

Flashlight237
Posts: 2251
Joined: Tue Jul 16, 2019 3:01 am

Re: Suggestions from Jakub

Post by Flashlight237 » Sun Mar 21, 2021 5:16 pm

1. Uh, actually, pretty much every RPG has a defense stat; sometimes it's worded differently (usually "armor"). Pokemon has two.
2. Already made Whipmaster; that's a planned feature (and it would have a tipper mechanic akin to Super Smash Bros).
3. With the Sharpening and Poisoning being an early-game feature, I'm pretty sure Robby wanted everyone to have access to runes. Plus they're already either somewhat rare (sharpening and hardening) or rare (everything else).
4. Animal Crossing already worked well with longer closing times than Eliatopia did. There's no need to remove store closures. Also, don't gatekeep, okay?
5. I don't see any reason to fix the damage formula, especially given its significantly fairer than all the past damage formulas Robby did for both Elia and HH. The formula before the fairer one we have now was best described as "tank or get one-shot" and HH's was screwy to where you can either take 0 damage or get utterly mauled by the same monster that dealt 0 damage to you.
6. Unnecessary. We already get patch notes through the website. Instead, just put a Patch Notes button in the game itself like in HH. It'll give players patch notes more easily on both the developer's end and the players' ends.

masnam
Posts: 538
Joined: Mon Jan 06, 2020 8:52 pm

Re: Suggestions from Jakub

Post by masnam » Sun Mar 21, 2021 7:29 pm

Flashlight237 wrote:
Sun Mar 21, 2021 5:16 pm
1. Uh, actually, pretty much every RPG has a defense stat; sometimes it's worded differently (usually "armor"). Pokemon has two.
2. Already made Whipmaster; that's a planned feature (and it would have a tipper mechanic akin to Super Smash Bros).
3. With the Sharpening and Poisoning being an early-game feature, I'm pretty sure Robby wanted everyone to have access to runes. Plus they're already either somewhat rare (sharpening and hardening) or rare (everything else).
4. Animal Crossing already worked well with longer closing times than Eliatopia did. There's no need to remove store closures. Also, don't gatekeep, okay?
5. I don't see any reason to fix the damage formula, especially given its significantly fairer than all the past damage formulas Robby did for both Elia and HH. The formula before the fairer one we have now was best described as "tank or get one-shot" and HH's was screwy to where you can either take 0 damage or get utterly mauled by the same monster that dealt 0 damage to you.
6. Unnecessary. We already get patch notes through the website. Instead, just put a Patch Notes button in the game itself like in HH. It'll give players patch notes more easily on both the developer's end and the players' ends.
1. What about the part where he said it can make any class tanky? Any response to that?
2. That's just one. I'm pretty sure he meant like 10 or something.
4. It doesn't matter if animal crossing has closing times. It is a useless feature which annoys everyone. Also, how was I gatekeeping?
5. Skill points put into strength, magic, artillery, and range do very very very very little to help your damage output.
6. The main reason was to have items that didn't sell get mailed back. The patch notes was something extra that was a little more fun then a button on the home screen.

Flashlight237
Posts: 2251
Joined: Tue Jul 16, 2019 3:01 am

Re: Suggestions from Jakub

Post by Flashlight237 » Sun Mar 21, 2021 8:51 pm

masnam wrote:
Sun Mar 21, 2021 7:29 pm
Flashlight237 wrote:
Sun Mar 21, 2021 5:16 pm
1. Uh, actually, pretty much every RPG has a defense stat; sometimes it's worded differently (usually "armor"). Pokemon has two.
2. Already made Whipmaster; that's a planned feature (and it would have a tipper mechanic akin to Super Smash Bros).
3. With the Sharpening and Poisoning being an early-game feature, I'm pretty sure Robby wanted everyone to have access to runes. Plus they're already either somewhat rare (sharpening and hardening) or rare (everything else).
4. Animal Crossing already worked well with longer closing times than Eliatopia did. There's no need to remove store closures. Also, don't gatekeep, okay?
5. I don't see any reason to fix the damage formula, especially given its significantly fairer than all the past damage formulas Robby did for both Elia and HH. The formula before the fairer one we have now was best described as "tank or get one-shot" and HH's was screwy to where you can either take 0 damage or get utterly mauled by the same monster that dealt 0 damage to you.
6. Unnecessary. We already get patch notes through the website. Instead, just put a Patch Notes button in the game itself like in HH. It'll give players patch notes more easily on both the developer's end and the players' ends.
1. What about the part where he said it can make any class tanky? Any response to that?
2. That's just one. I'm pretty sure he meant like 10 or something.
4. It doesn't matter if animal crossing has closing times. It is a useless feature which annoys everyone. Also, how was I gatekeeping?
5. Skill points put into strength, magic, artillery, and range do very very very very little to help your damage output.
6. The main reason was to have items that didn't sell get mailed back. The patch notes was something extra that was a little more fun then a button on the home screen.
1. Yes. While, yes, warrior sets are meant to be tanky, the other sets (in addition to the defense stat) are made as durable as they are to allow other classes to keep up with the right build. Quite frankly, I wouldn't want to be any class other than what is essentially a crusader if other classes weren't allowed to keep up at a fair pace (I would accept a variance between 0.85 and 1.15 assuming 1 is the median value). (Before you bring it up again, yes, I thought about making flails for warriors to get people to start using shields; I've yet to see anyone use a shield right now even when they provide defensive boosts, which I personally find disappointing)
2. Yeah, don't bother asking for 10. I only managed to make the Whipmaster class alone unique from what we currently have and I already had a tough time coming up with a sixth unique class (now I understand what Robby meant when he told me it would be overkill). Bear in mind I had to think about each standard class (thief, bard, etc) and whether they would work or not. I learned the hard way that you really just can't ask for more classes if you can't prop them up. Don't make things harder for me than they already are; I already have to do most of the thinking because hardly anyone else can do math here (and I'm sure Robby's tired of me making breakdowns).
4. Actually, yes it does. If Animal Crossing players (which there are millions of) can deal with double Eliatopia's closing hours, without complaint at that, I don't see why anyone should complain about Eliatopia's closing times.
5. That's only because people stuffed 100 points into expertise without second thought, which I was scornful of and still am proud of swatting away to this day. Unless Robby can better answer that for me, all I can say is those 60 points (or more since leveling up got buffed) could've made quite a difference if they weren't stuffed into expertise (as I can personally attest to as a former 10-expertise warrior).
6. So just put the button in both the menu and the UI. That's what idle games (among them NGU Idle) did. I don't want the database to suffer from forseeable bandwidth concerns over a mailing system (even if there are just around 20 people who play this thing alts-excluded).

masnam
Posts: 538
Joined: Mon Jan 06, 2020 8:52 pm

Re: Suggestions from Jakub

Post by masnam » Sun Mar 21, 2021 10:27 pm

Flashlight237 wrote:
Sun Mar 21, 2021 8:51 pm
masnam wrote:
Sun Mar 21, 2021 7:29 pm
Flashlight237 wrote:
Sun Mar 21, 2021 5:16 pm
1. Uh, actually, pretty much every RPG has a defense stat; sometimes it's worded differently (usually "armor"). Pokemon has two.
2. Already made Whipmaster; that's a planned feature (and it would have a tipper mechanic akin to Super Smash Bros).
3. With the Sharpening and Poisoning being an early-game feature, I'm pretty sure Robby wanted everyone to have access to runes. Plus they're already either somewhat rare (sharpening and hardening) or rare (everything else).
4. Animal Crossing already worked well with longer closing times than Eliatopia did. There's no need to remove store closures. Also, don't gatekeep, okay?
5. I don't see any reason to fix the damage formula, especially given its significantly fairer than all the past damage formulas Robby did for both Elia and HH. The formula before the fairer one we have now was best described as "tank or get one-shot" and HH's was screwy to where you can either take 0 damage or get utterly mauled by the same monster that dealt 0 damage to you.
6. Unnecessary. We already get patch notes through the website. Instead, just put a Patch Notes button in the game itself like in HH. It'll give players patch notes more easily on both the developer's end and the players' ends.
1. What about the part where he said it can make any class tanky? Any response to that?
2. That's just one. I'm pretty sure he meant like 10 or something.
4. It doesn't matter if animal crossing has closing times. It is a useless feature which annoys everyone. Also, how was I gatekeeping?
5. Skill points put into strength, magic, artillery, and range do very very very very little to help your damage output.
6. The main reason was to have items that didn't sell get mailed back. The patch notes was something extra that was a little more fun then a button on the home screen.
1. Yes. While, yes, warrior sets are meant to be tanky, the other sets (in addition to the defense stat) are made as durable as they are to allow other classes to keep up with the right build. Quite frankly, I wouldn't want to be any class other than what is essentially a crusader if other classes weren't allowed to keep up at a fair pace (I would accept a variance between 0.85 and 1.15 assuming 1 is the median value). (Before you bring it up again, yes, I thought about making flails for warriors to get people to start using shields; I've yet to see anyone use a shield right now even when they provide defensive boosts, which I personally find disappointing)
2. Yeah, don't bother asking for 10. I only managed to make the Whipmaster class alone unique from what we currently have and I already had a tough time coming up with a sixth unique class (now I understand what Robby meant when he told me it would be overkill). Bear in mind I had to think about each standard class (thief, bard, etc) and whether they would work or not. I learned the hard way that you really just can't ask for more classes if you can't prop them up. Don't make things harder for me than they already are; I already have to do most of the thinking because hardly anyone else can do math here (and I'm sure Robby's tired of me making breakdowns).
4. Actually, yes it does. If Animal Crossing players (which there are millions of) can deal with double Eliatopia's closing hours, without complaint at that, I don't see why anyone should complain about Eliatopia's closing times.
5. That's only because people stuffed 100 points into expertise without second thought, which I was scornful of and still am proud of swatting away to this day. Unless Robby can better answer that for me, all I can say is those 60 points (or more since leveling up got buffed) could've made quite a difference if they weren't stuffed into expertise (as I can personally attest to as a former 10-expertise warrior).
6. So just put the button in both the menu and the UI. That's what idle games (among them NGU Idle) did. I don't want the database to suffer from forseeable bandwidth concerns over a mailing system (even if there are just around 20 people who play this thing alts-excluded).
1. I'll let Jakub respond to this one because it was his idea. Also, I use a shield.
2. He also suggested keeping different playstlyes in categories. Like melee, range, and magic categories with sub playstyles
4. Bro, this is elia, we aren't here to play animal crossing. No one cares if millions of animal crossing players deal with it. We don't want to and it's a dumb mechanic.
5. Active put all of his ~160 points into range and he got a slight slight increase in damage output that probably isn't noticeable. CrazyVanilla also compared his and Active's stats with the same amount of expertise and active had barley more damage with way more points.

masnam
Posts: 538
Joined: Mon Jan 06, 2020 8:52 pm

Re: Suggestions from Jakub

Post by masnam » Thu Apr 01, 2021 4:59 pm

bump for that big response

masnam
Posts: 538
Joined: Mon Jan 06, 2020 8:52 pm

Re: Suggestions from Jakub

Post by masnam » Fri Apr 09, 2021 2:44 pm

I sleep

masnam
Posts: 538
Joined: Mon Jan 06, 2020 8:52 pm

Re: Suggestions from Jakub

Post by masnam » Mon Apr 12, 2021 11:18 am

:?: :arrow: :x

Jakub34
Posts: 477
Joined: Wed Jul 17, 2019 11:03 pm

Re: Suggestions from Jakub

Post by Jakub34 » Mon Apr 12, 2021 4:56 pm

1. Coming soon™

2. Coming soon™

3. Coming soon™

4. Coming soon™

5. Coming soon™

Mailbox
The mail system is something I think that should really be added into the game. There's a lot of stuff that you can put in there, so a player knows what is going on. The biggest use I can definitely see for this right now is the vendor. I'm not sure how it works now, as I never sold anything, but it would be nice to have a place to keep track of what you sold, and how much you sold it for. I think this would be a lot better than just having some text popping up on the screen telling you what you sold. Another thing I can definitely see this being great for is sending patch notes. I am sure not everyone wants to have to log onto the site, just to read what is new. Having it in game would be nice as you just need to log into the game to read what is new.

Depending on what content we get later down the road, I'm sure the mailbox would make a nice addition for sending certain information to players.

Enemy knockback
This one can get annoying, because it is stupid that an enemy that deals 1 damage can knockback the player. Once the player has anywhere from 80% to 150% defense of the enemy's power (whatever value you choose), the player will no longer receive knockback. For example, an enemy with 50 power would have an average damage of 2500. The player would need anywhere from 2000-3750 armor to not be affected by knockback anymore. (Once again, based on whatever percentage value you choose)

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