New item price formula

[Jakub34]

Since I guess fixed prices are not going to happen, why not rewrite the formula. The progression for the prices of items feels really out of place, and all of it needs to be significantly toned down. The scaling of prices also gets out of hand really quickly as we approach bigger numbers. Down below is a list of the defense stat and how much the item would cost.

100: 1m 220: 10.6m 400: 64m

120: 1.72m 240: 13.8m 500: 125m

140: 2.74m 260: 17.5m 600: 216m

160: 4.09m 280: 21.9m 700: 343m

180: 5.83m 300: 27m 800: 512m

200: 8m 350: 42.8m 900: 729m

As you can see with the values that increment by 20, the price begins to rise by over a million and only increases faster and faster. These prices do not account for the class stat, and the reason why I did not account for them is because of how much smaller they may be in comparison to the defense stat. Also, it is important to note that these prices are just for one piece of armor. Multiply it by 3 and that's your actual value. This is also not taking shoes, weapons, and accessories into consideration, so the price would be even higher.

The new formula I have came up with is defense^2.45 + strength^3.2 + ranged^3.2 + magic^3.2 + artillery^3.2. As you can see, the formula is pretty much the same thing, except that I scaled the defense back and remove the unneeded + 1. (Not sure why that is there. 0 to any exponent is just 0) With how high the defense stat is in comparison to the class stat, there is no reason to have it scaling at the rate of ^3 As mentioned above, the class stat has very little affect on the price of an item due to how high defense is. With the formula I wrote, the class stat actually has some affect on the price.

Here is a list of how the new prices would look

Skull Crusher Current: 1,460,600
Skull Crusher New: 134,607

Ancient Legs Current: 1,077,178
Ancient Legs New: 107,804

Bronze Plate Legs Current: 448,240
Bronze Plate Legs New: 53,819

Tribal Legs Current: 663,085
Tribal Legs New: 101,179

Jungle Legs Current: 457,725
Jungle Legs New: 73,011

Got lazy filling out the rest, but you get the point

Element Legs Current: 756,003
Element Legs New: 107,531

Wrangler Legs Current: 799,373
Wrangler Legs New: 98,898

Going to ignore items that have roughly the same price, since their new will be just about the same as the other new prices.

Magician Legs Current: 435
Magician Legs New: 224

Larper Robe Current: 858
Larper Robe New: 426

Red Archer Legs Current: 1,219
Red Archer Legs New: 390

Police Vest Current: 9,900
Police Vest New: 2,130

Wolf Hat Current: 2,063
Wolf Hat New: 1,057

Bowman Jacket Current: 3,531
Bowman Jacket New: 3,122

Blue Wizard Hat Current: 2,243
Blue Wizard Hat New: 2,267 (Actually became a slightly more expensive lol)

Eggplant Helmet Current: 7,834
Eggplant Helmet New: 3,296

Spec Ops Helmet Current: 19,307
Spec Ops Helmet New: 4,810

Moonlight Helmet Current: 10,200
Moonlight Helmet New: 4,198

Acrylic Helmet Current: 24,735
Acrylic Helmet New: 3,820

Rusted Bronze Helmet Current: 53,400
Rusted Bronze Helmet New: 10,170

Pollution Legs Current: 32,206
Pollution Legs New: 7,171

Citonium Helmet Current: 27,891
Citonium Helmet New: 8,247

Opal Helmet Current: 38,163
Opal Helmet New: 7,720

Knight Helmet Current: 88,562
Knight Helmet New: 14,697

Romance Helmet Current: 86,584
Roman Helmet New: 20,051

Paladin Helmet Current: 192,081
Paladin Helmet New: 29,594

Neon Shark Helmet Current: 82,557
Neon shark Helmet New: 21,692

Fiber Glass Helmet Current: 75,783
Fiber Glass Helmet New: 18,810

Reaper Helmet Current: 209,278
Reaper Helmet New: 43,075

So I think this covers just about most of everything that needed to be covered. What's nice about these prices is that the sets for each class are a lot closer in price, and the prices do not immediately jump up to insane amounts. I think there is definitely some work that could still be done to round out the prices more. If exponents are going to be change, then I would recommend only moving them up or down by 0.05 or 0.1. You could also change the formula a slight bit by doing defense^2.45 * 1.25. It won't change the price too much, but it will have some difference at the very least.

As for weapons, I think just adjusting the exponent down to weaponPower^2.5 should be good enough. This should hopefully be good enough to keep weapon prices close to armor prices.

Money, money, money!
Alright, if item prices do decrease, then the amount of money players make obviously needs to decrease. Since item costs would be going down, this would mean everything would sell for a lot less, so it's possible that the problem does solve itself. I do not think coins themselves should be an issue, because to afford something like the tribal legs would require you to kill 1,744 stalkers.

[Flashlight237]

I already beat you there in that regard. Here's what I got.:

Equipment Price: 5*defense^2.5+5*strength^2.5+5*magic^2.5+5*archery^2.5+5*artillery^2.5+(5*dexterity^2.5)

Dexterity=Whipmaster attack stat

Weapon Price: 5*weapon power^2.5*h*r

h=handedness modifier (1 for one-handed weapons, 0.85 for flails and whips, 0.7 for two-handed weapons); r=rate of fire modifier (25/rate of fire)

Everything's already easily obtainable up until Renegades' (whether it be Tier 1 or Tier 2 is debatable), so I think what I had is fairer.

[Spadeee]

Support!

[masnam]

I'd half the current prices. ez

[CrazyVanilla]

While I agree the item prices are a bit much, I think this is too cheap. There really isn't anything to spend gold on besides items, so they should be somewhat expensive. I do agree the formula should be changed though, for example the difference between Jungle and Mystic sets are pretty much nothing in terms of a noticeable difference in gameplay, but Mystic is quite a bit more expensive. I would imagine a set that actually makes even a small but noticeable difference to a player would be at least double the price of the current Mystic set.

I think the main problem lies with the scaling of the game so far, armor has WELL outpaced the strength and worth of mobs (The sets SEEM very expensive because there is very little gameplay-value in purchasing them). As you well know, pretty much everything above Lunatic/Paladin level sets are just for either cosmetics or a flex, it is not needed for gameplay. The sets above those seem to be more "Beetle level+" sets, which is more than 3x the xp of everything else (even tho they are horrible for money). There is also a very large gap between Beetles and everything else which doesn't help.

[Flashlight237]

While I agree the item prices are a bit much, I think this is too cheap. There really isn't anything to spend gold on besides items, so they should be somewhat expensive. I do agree the formula should be changed though, for example the difference between Jungle and Mystic sets are pretty much nothing in terms of a noticeable difference in gameplay, but Mystic is quite a bit more expensive. I would imagine a set that actually makes even a small but noticeable difference to a player would be at least double the price of the current Mystic set.

I think the main problem lies with the scaling of the game so far, armor has WELL outpaced the strength and worth of mobs (The sets SEEM very expensive because there is very little gameplay-value in purchasing them). As you well know, pretty much everything above Lunatic/Paladin level sets are just for either cosmetics or a flex, it is not needed for gameplay. The sets above those seem to be more "Beetle level+" sets, which is more than 3x the xp of everything else (even tho they are horrible for money). There is also a very large gap between Beetles and everything else which doesn't help.

That's what I was thinking. As a warrior with a full Lunatic set and an Igneous Rock (H2 with and S3 E1 Lunatic Hammer), I saw no point in going further since I can nail everything that isn't an Auroch Beetle (with Stalagmites requiring that I make use of skills). I do think that Jakub's formula will also cause too much confusion on everyone's end in addition to your "too cheap" point. Here's what I got.:

Equipment Price: 5*defense^2.5+5*strength^2.5+5*magic^2.5+5*archery^2.5+5*artillery^2.5+(5*dexterity^2.5)

Dexterity=Whipmaster attack stat

Weapon Price: 5*weapon power^2.5*h*r

h=handedness modifier (1 for one-handed weapons, 0.85 for flails and whips, 0.7 for two-handed weapons); r=rate of fire modifier (25/rate of fire)

From what I got, early-game equipment prices retain their cheapness while armors from Tier 1 or Tier 2 Renegade sets onwards grow cheaper. Applying my formula to warrior sets only (since these are the sets people have the most problems with), this is how they would be priced with my formula.


Bronze Plate Piece Current: $448,240
Bronze Plate Legs New: $252,513

Magnesium Piece Current: $718,796
Magnesium Legs New: $375910

Ancient Piece Current: $1,077,178
Ancient Piece New: $527,144

Skull Crusher Current: 1,460,600
Skull Crusher New: $679,551

It's close to Masnam's "half-price" idea, but I think it works much better.

[CrazyVanilla]

From what I got, early-game equipment prices retain their cheapness while armors from Tier 1 or Tier 2 Renegade sets onwards grow cheaper. Applying my formula to warrior sets only (since these are the sets people have the most problems with), this is how they would be priced with my formula.


Bronze Plate Piece Current: $448,240
Bronze Plate Legs New: $252,513

Magnesium Piece Current: $718,796
Magnesium Legs New: $375910

Ancient Piece Current: $1,077,178
Ancient Piece New: $527,144

Skull Crusher Current: 1,460,600
Skull Crusher New: $679,551

It's close to Masnam's "half-price" idea, but I think it works much better.

I think your formula makes more sense, though I still believe it will not totally solve the problem for the future. I think the problem to be fixed is the balance between sets & mobs. Like I mentioned, for the most part the sets SEEM too expensive because relative to other sets there is very little gameplay benefit from purchasing them, its not necessarily that they ARE too expensive. In other words, you are paying $4,381,800 for Skull Crusher Set (not including weapon(s), boots, accessories, and upgrades for this example) in order to grind Stalagmites, which can for the most part be just as easily grinded with a Lunatic set, giving essentially the same money and xp return wether you have Skull Crusher or Lunatic (which off the top of my head is ~10% the cost of skull crusher?). This is where I think mob rebalancing / properly balancing new mobs would have a more beneficial impact (and also not upset the players who already spent millions on these sets, cuz lets face it there would be a lot of complaining).

Side note: I do still think the formula should be altered, I just don't think it is the main problem

[masnam]

Bump

[masnam]

bump

[mikel]

tbh with the amount of spotters and overpowered people in game already, and as a guy who can barely farm because of those. Support.